Talk:Chem395:February 29 discussion

Sorry I was in another meeting and lost all track of time!

The agenda item is: What approach to manufacturing is most appropriate for a sustainable society?

Discussion

There are several approaches to manufacturing - sequential, concurrent - lean manufacturing, craft manufacturing. What are the pros and cons of each? We want something to be efficient (= less waste), but we also don't want something that is "efficient" with disregard for the environment. What approach should be used. Walkerma 16:18, 29 February 2008 (EST)

An approach to manufacturing that focuses on an industrial ecology. J-Fed 16:17, 29 February 2008 (EST)

Can you elaborate, Jesse? Walkerma 16:18, 29 February 2008 (EST)

• This includes sector initiatives: DFE, Sustainable Agriculture and Forestry and Sustainable energy systems. Implementation Initiatives: industrial ecology and R&D agendas, materials / models/databases and comprehensive risk assesments and risk priorititzation. These initiatives form and ecological infrastructure which form an industry based on ecology and therefore become sustainbale. J-Fed 16:21, 29 February 2008 (EST)

The electrical, electronics and telecommunications sectors are enablers of sustainability because they allow the provision of increasing quality-of-life using less material and energy, respectively, dematerialization and decarbonization (Dorff 135). J-Fed 16:23, 29 February 2008 (EST)

The study of industrial ecology will, in the long run, provide the means by which the human species can deliberately and rationally approach a deireable long-term global carrying capacity (Dorff 135). J-Fed 16:24, 29 February 2008 (EST)

Great point about the electronics. But can you be more specific, how will we make our cars or other methods of transportation? Walkerma 16:26, 29 February 2008 (EST)

• In such a system, little if any marginal input is required, and little if any waste that must be disposed of outside of the economic system is generated (Dorff 135). This is great because companies can use innovation and new procedures to become a forefront in the field. J-Fed 16:29, 29 February 2008 (EST)

• We can use quality function development (QFDs) to use for product development. Even VOC ( voice of the customer) are useful in determining how companies should approach product development. J-Fed 16:29, 29 February 2008 (EST)

Yes, taking an environmental approach to innovation could reap immense benefits for the environment. But should we make those bicycles on a production line, or have them hand made by Albanian peasants, or what? Walkerma 16:32, 29 February 2008 (EST)

Good question. Maybe if all the bikes are made in automotive plants instead of cars and SUVs we could eliminate many of the problems we face currently in the US. =] J-Fed 16:34, 29 February 2008 (EST)

• More exercise and fresh air is good for everybody ! :]J-Fed 16:35, 29 February 2008 (EST)

But I want to press this point. Is mass production the best way to make bicycles? Are their flaws with it? What about lean production? Walkerma 16:36, 29 February 2008 (EST)

BTW, I'm not saying there's one right answer to this - I'm merely interested in your opinion. Walkerma 16:37, 29 February 2008 (EST)

The production line is still viable. Having the peasants make them isn't too bad either at least they have a job. It would allow them to help their environment more then if they didn't have a job. J-Fed 16:38, 29 February 2008 (EST)

When we talked about poverty and its affects on the environment it was imperative that the locals have jobs, but not monopoly companies taking over their area. J-Fed 16:39, 29 February 2008 (EST)

This becomes very political though. many people in the US for instance don not like the idea of outsourcing. However, does the environment actually benefit from it? That would be a really interesting question to study! J-Fed 16:41, 29 February 2008 (EST)

This is true - but I want you to take a global perspective. The US wouldn't like Albanian peasants operating a production line, either!

How should you weigh the efficiency benefits of lean production on a Toyota-type production line against the more "human-based" approach of craft manufacturing? There may be much more waste with the craft system, even though it shows the ruddy-faced craftsman working by hand in the old-fashioned workshop. Walkerma 16:43, 29 February 2008 (EST)

I guess I would say that efficiency is measured in how long the product (Toyotas) can be used for. The cost-benefit ratio in making vehicles is to high making them an old-fashioned way. J-Fed 16:45, 29 February 2008 (EST)

It used to be said that craft production produced longer-lasting products, but that is no longer necessarily true. And those electronics you mentioned - you simply can't make a microprocessor all by hand! But how do we include the human factor? Do we want to have a production system that only looks at profits? Are there other approaches that could be more suitable for the eco-society? What would you change (if anything) in a lean manfacturing system, such as the TPS?

Oh ok! Well I would include more human investment in the company (capital). More greener processes. More innovation by individuals in developing better processes or equipment. There needs to be of of an entrepenuer attitude toward industry so that businesses can grow faster and expand. Also it would benefit the environment. J-Fed 16:53, 29 February 2008 (EST)

Cutting down the work hours that a plant runs for might help lower emissions for instance. J-Fed 16:54, 29 February 2008 (EST)

Or would that simply reduce the productiveness (aka efficiency) of the plant? Now we have to build two plants to make the same number of bicycles that used to be produced in one plant!

I'd have to go with a concurrent system for a majority of the time and then sequential depending on the product. J-Fed 16:56, 29 February 2008 (EST)

Sounds reasonable. I like the more innovation idea you mentioned above - if you encourage environmental innovation by the plant workers, they will have much more invested in their work and they will help the environment, too. How could that be done in practice, at a place like Acme or Toyota? Walkerma 16:58, 29 February 2008 (EST)

I believe so. Offering "inovation awards" or excellence services could increase productivity and help the workers' morale. J-Fed 17:00, 29 February 2008 (EST)

OK, we should wrap things up. I don't know what happened to Chris, but I can't say a thing....! Anything else you want to mention before we go? Walkerma 17:02, 29 February 2008 (EST)

That was great!! Thank you! I hope Chris is alright.... anyway have a great afternoon! J-Fed 17:03, 29 February 2008 (EST)