Chem321:Discussion 3

THE SUSTAINABLE WORLD (Chemistry 321)
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This discussion is based on discussing two questions, and it is set to take place on the wiki, over the next few days (until midnight on Monday, 16th July). We will leave comments on the page below, in response to (and under) the questions posted or the related responses. Be sure to start your text with a *, and sign your responses with four tilde marks at the end.

The Internet

In what ways can we use the Internet to help the environment? In what ways might it harm the environment?

• The internet can be a useful aid in helping the environment. One of the major ways that it helps is by providing information to citizens about: what actions are environmentally unfriendly, what can and can't be recycled, how certain ecosystems function, environmental history, modifications that can be made to reduce CO2 emissions, etc. The internet is incredibly useful is supplying information to citizens who don't have a background in this field and often puts ideas into simpler terms so that it's not like reading a textbook. The internet also provides a method of meeting with coworkers without having to commute. Skype, as we all know, is a convenient application that allows for face to face chat without having to leave the comfort of your home. This kind of application helps save on fossil fuel usage. However, the internet can also harm the environment. The internet itself is run over computers (which take a lot of energy to produce and have several negative by products in production and labor), which run on electricity (coal-fueled). This means that using the internet has a high CO2 footprint. Also, since we're so dependent on the internet and we use it so frequently, our energy costs have increased. HKopelson (talk) 08:05, 12 July 2012 (EDT)

• The internet has been a great invention. It has allowed me to take this class without having to get in my car and commute to a class everyday. It has also allowed people to have face to face conversations from great distances that would otherwise have to fly or drive to see each other(good demonstration of this is the movie Up In The Air.) The internet has also allowed people to share knowledge that couldn't have been shared outside of books and textbooks just decades ago. These are some aspects of how the internet contributes to sustainability. However, computers use vast amounts of energy each year and are composed of parts such as silicon that require huge amounts of energy to purify into a form that is useable in computers, which creates a lot of CO2 emissions. Technology changes quickly in the electronics industry which causes many computers to be thrown away long before they are not useful. This causes increased wastes in the world's landfills. Many end up being somewhat recycled in developing countries such as China, where the waste is not disposed of properly and creates health hazards to the local population. Maxwelk192 (talk) 14:42, 12 July 2012 (EDT)

• • Up in the Air is a good pop culture reference - thanks!

• The internet has had a positive impact for the environment. There are endless opportunities at your finger tips on the web. This class for example is helping the environment, by allowing all of us to communicate and take this course without having to drive to any location. So many companies are now going paperless, almost every bill I have I can pay online. Suny Potsdam is even going paperless, paying our tuition bills online. I also have used textbooks over the web, that reduces the amount of paper products being used. Just think of the ebooks available, reducing paper use, even libraries have book access online. The education opportunities are endless on the internet, learning greener ways of living from very basic to more advanced levels are available on line. Of course there are negative affects as well.Technology changes and advances so quickly that our gadgets are outdated within months. Where do all these old gadgets go, how much waste and pollution is produced by this. It made me think of the BBC assignment from Unit 1, the towns that are full of old electronics in China. Children and adults make their livelihood by melting down and collecting pieces of old computer parts. The fumes and hazardous material on these parts cause incredible damage to these people. There are no regulations for these people in these towns, they are paid meager amounts, but they have no choice. Emitch (talk) 13:05, 13 July 2012 (EDT)

• • I'm at this conference, where obviously using the internet for education is valued! Yesterday I met a young Kenyan guy - about your age - who is taking Wikipedia content and making electronic books from it to match the local curriculum, then he and his friends have done a deal with the Ministry of Education to put copies of these ebooks (on biology, chemistry, etc) onto computers in schools where typically few students have any books (due to poverty). Very exciting for me to see this happening! This shows an effect also on addressing inequalities in the world, something we discussed previously. Martin A. Walker 07:47, 15 July 2012 (EDT)

• The internet, with all of the routers, servers, and computers used to browse it, uses a tremendous amount of electricity. Much of this electricity is coming from fossil fuels and contributing greenhouse gases to the atmosphere. The materials used to build the computers can also be very harmful to the environment such as the chemicals used to make plasma screen and lcd monitors. Because of the rapid advancement of technology, has led to what was top of the line this year being outdated the next. Now people buy new computers and phones every couple of years, causing a lot waste to throw away the old technology, and using up resources to build these devices. On the other hand, the internet has become the biggest source of information around the globe and if someone wants to learn about sustainability, the internet will give them more articles and information than they could ever possibly hope to read and watch. Online classes, allow people to go to school without having to make long commutes to get to class saving fuel. Business meetings can be done online, allowing people to not have to catch a plane just to get to a meeting. I believe the the value of the Internet as an information and communication source far outweighs any impact it may have on the environment. SamRussell (talk) 20:48, 13 July 2012 (EDT)

• • The internet is a very beneficial form of technology, but just because it is beneficial does not mean that it doesn't also come with harmful actions. Mostly everything now-a-days have both a beneficial and a harmful effect on the environment. The internet allows people to keep in touch in a much easier way than what the past allowed us to do. We used to have to write letters, on paper, and depending on the length of the letter (how much one person would have to say) would depend on how much paper would be getting used- along with the envelope and stamps (which also used paper). Having the internet to communicate to one another saves the amount of paper that is being used throughout the world. Another way in which technology is a good thing is the amount of internet banking that is being used. I remember when I first signed up for a bank account, there wasn't internet banking (or it was newer), so each month I would get statements in the mail, sometimes these statements being pages long. The use of internet banking allows banks to not send out so many paper statements, which overall helps the pollution and reduces the amount of forests being killed. Even if people still receive paper statements, majority of people check on the internet (along with credit card bills). The internet also allows for students to do homework via the internet (like this!!), but even for "regular" classes, so teacher can stop using worksheets-- and hopefully with time textbooks soon will be via the internet, so more paper will be saved! Ways in which the internet harm the environment are more indirect than directive. Computers themselves harm the environment because of the harsh metals that are used within to build the computers. amannme192Amannme192 (talk) 19:34, 14 July 2012 (EDT)
    • Everything we do has costs and benefits. Hindus and Buhdists call this phenomena Karma:)Stewarjm192 (talk) 20:53, 14 July 2012 (EDT)
• During the early 90's is when the internet as we know it today was born. Since that time, it has become multitudes faster, advancing from dial-up connection, to DSL, to cable, and now to fiber optic connection. From the very beginning, even the slowest connections could yield an unbelievable amount of information. This information,with the ease of access and speed at which we can access it today helps multitudes of people. From the amateur musician researching new equipment, to the organic farmer looking for ways to boost their crop yields in a sustainable way, this information betters peoples lives. Poor people can more easily access information that can benefit them monetarily, such as gaining knowledge for better job placement and the like. Like our classmates have also said previously, the internet has made communication possible that, without it, would use precious fuels and materials. With programs like Skype and Instant Message, we are able to talk to loved ones, friends, and business contacts around the world easily and for little out-of-pocket cost, without having to spend money on transportation. Spending less on transportation, and also the reduced cost of information, allow consumers to spend their money on other things that will bring them greater satisfaction. This could mean that they will spend their extra money on more sustainable goods and energy sources.(i.e solar panels or geothermal systems) With all the benefits that the internet brings, so with it comes equal costs. Although travel is less needed, decreasing the amount of fuel oil used in the turbine engines of plains or other combustion engines, the energy used to run, maintain and build the infrastructure that we use while accessing the internet is enormous. Although less people are traveling, more and more are powering modems, router, computers and mainframes, thus using more and more energy. The electrical energy used to power these devices comes from the burning of coal and other fossil fuels. Also, the waste that is created by the never ceasing increase in technology is just as detrimental if not more harmful to the environment than the older ways that we got the things we get from the internet. Overall, the internet is a wonderful technology. The benefits that it brings at this point, however, just barely outweigh the costs it brings, but it will not fail us. I believe that the internet will exponentially increase its benefits while it also exponential reduces its costs.Stewarjm192 (talk) 20:51, 14 July 2012 (EDT)

• I don't think that the internet directly harms or helps the environment. It has made it easier to communicate with others without using gas to see them, but that is what the telephone used to be for. People can buy items more readily on sites through amazon instead of using gas to go to the store or mall, but shipping uses that up gas anyway. A negative impact could be the issue of technologies like phones constantly changing. People will throw away an old phone without wifi or a good design for internet use even though it's in perfect condition. We have become a fast paced society partly through internet usage and always having information at our fingertips, but this is also because of technology changes.Racinea (talk) 21:33, 15 July 2012 (EDT)

• The Internet has both helped and harmed the environment, but I think it has been more of a help than a detriment. The Internet has helped people use paper less and less for everyday things. We write e-mails to other people nowadays instead of letters, postcards, and the like, for example. People often do their banking and pay their bills on the Internet. Use of the Internet also helps to reduce gas emissions. Sites such as eBay and Amazon exist so that people can do their shopping over the Internet instead of driving to the supermarket or department store. People can communicate directly with each other on Skype, MSN, or in an online class such as this one. Instead of driving all the way to the library to research information, people can just use Google. The only negative impacts that I think the Internet has had is that there are so many people using it, and thus lots of computers are being used at once. These computers suck up a lot of energy and many of them are not energy efficient at all. If computer companies could find ways to make computers use less energy, then the Internet will have even less of an impact on the environment. AndrewSears (talk) 22:05, 15 July 2012 (EDT)

Clearly, you can all see the pros and cons here, though I think the energy usage for the internet is probably a lot less than for other things (the servers for Wikipedia - I think - mostly live in one large room, and handle hundreds of millions of hits a day). The issue of electronics materials is serious, though clearly not just limited to the internet or even to computers. However, I'd like to ask a followup question: How might you try to reduce the environmental impact of the energy usage and harmful materials, and can you suggest new ways in which we could take advantage of the internet to reduce our carbon footprint more? Responses below here, please! Martin A. Walker 07:47, 15 July 2012 (EDT)

Technology

How can technology help to reduce our (negative) impact on the environment? When can it increase our impact? How can we avoid some of the negative effects of technology? (Do not simply replicate your arguments from above, but consider different types of technology such as cars, washing machines, scientific instruments, etc.)

• I'd argue that certain advancements in technology can reduce our negative impacts on the environment. For example, the efficiency of the scrubbers used in coal producing facilities has been enhanced to reduce Sulfur content entering the atmosphere. Cars today can also be more efficient in mileage through hybrid technology, enhanced design, or through a fully electric design. There's also technology that helps reduce our emissions, such as solar panels. By relying on solar panels, our carbon emissions drop substantially because we're getting our power from a non-polluting source and turning it into a renewable resource. Advancements in technology can also lead to a better understanding of how the environment functions, which can reduce some of the negative impacts we cause daily. However, technology can also increase our negative impact on the environment. For example, our hardware updates (cell phones, laptops, etc.) occur more often than our software updates, which means people are buying newer hardware more often. If software updated more frequently and could be downloaded easily to major platforms, then there would be less waste of technology because the advancements wouldn't need to come in a physical form. Also, to advance technology, we need natural resources. How do we get natural resources? By exploiting the environment in search of them. I know I mentioned this in my last post, but the advancement of technology often comes at the expense of mountains, forests, and water bodies. There are ways we can avoid these harmful effects, though. You could rely on technology less. Don't replace your cell phone or laptop so often, don't waste electricity; use your gadgets at home less. Don't dry your clothes in the summer time, hang them out to dry. Through industry, we could become more dependent on software vs. hardware, which would make a big difference in consumer purchases. There are many different ways we could reduce our negative impact on the environment through cutting back on the use of technology.HKopelson (talk) 07:51, 13 July 2012 (EDT)

• Technology has been a blessing and a curse for the environment. Technology has brought about the rise of increased industry, consumption, pollution and convenience. The invention of the automobile and our ability to produce them in the millions each year has no doubt resulted in increased carbon emissions. Technology, however, has also reduced pollution in this industry by the introduction of catalytic converters, more efficient computers in replacement of carburators, and unleaded fuel in replace of lead based gasoline, which have improved upon the original concept of the automobile and its impact on the environment. However, gasoline prices have increased over the years, so has the efficency of the way we burn it, which has made the cost of driving relatively constant. This has made us increasingly resistant to new forms of energy resources because the cost of fuel is relatively cheap for the great distances it can take us. Technology has allowed us to produce many more cars than we once did at lower costs. With more cars on the road with less impact, one has to wonder if more people driving more efficent and "environmentally friendly" cars causes more pollution than a few people driving a Model T. Since cars are more efficient and cheaper, more people now have access to a car tan ever before. There are also more roads than in the past and cars are more reliable than ever, which results in more people driving more often for longer distances. On the surface, it appears we have improved but in fact we may have a wider impact today than we ever have. Maxwelk192 (talk) 11:57, 14 July 2012 (EDT)

• Technology, since the Industrial Revolution (or even before!), has had multiple different effects on the environment. Technology has allowed people to live longer and healthier lives, with helping to bring about medicines and modern hospitals. With the use of modern day technology some forms of technology, such as hybrid cars, energy star appliances, automatic turn offs on some electronics, solar powered energy, and wind powered energy. These forms of technology are used to help improve the impact that we have left so far on the Earth, to help conserve the resources that we are using at a drastic rate; with the population increasing who knows how much natural resources we have left, the use of these forms of technology may delay the rate at which we are using the resources. Some ways technology harms our environment is by the fossil fuels that we use, the amount of gasoline we go through between cars and public transportation. Gasoline is not only used for transportation but also in some of our houses to help cook or keep our homes warm throughout the winter seasons. Electricity, and the forms of technology that come with it are also harming out Earth. We not only have electricity running almost 24/7 (even if something is plugged in and not running it is still using electricity!!), but the waste that these products leave, even if recycled, is really damaging our Earth. There are places in China where old laptops or electronics go, and some pieces of these can't be fully recycled- which makes a landmine, which causes environmental issues. Technology also causes pollution in the air and in the water- which is killing off many different species of animals. All species of animals are needed in order to keep the ecosystems going the way they should, if the ecosystems begin to fail, it will have a major effect in the human race. Also, the use of technology is making a huge damper in the forests and starting to dry up different water ways, forests are starting to become very sparse-- which again is bad for animals that live in them. We can avoid some impacts of technology by not buying a new computer every time something goes wrong, but to try to get it fixed, people can start using more solar powered energy within their homes, even though it is expensive to get installed the outcome for the cost and the environment are very good. People during the summer can air dry clothes, and keep their drier UNPLUGGED; therefore no electricity is being used. Also, when things aren't being used unplug them! Try to put electronics in places where they are easier to get unplugged. Finally, people can start walking places. I feel as though the human race has been very lazy- and are driving places that are in walking distance (or bicycling) distance away! This way the use of gasoline will stay lower. amannme192Amannme192 (talk) 20:19, 14 July 2012 (EDT)
• Technology helps us reduce our impact on the environment in multitudes of ways. Most notable, technology in recent years has reduced the amount of gasoline burned in cars. Transportation devices (cars, trucks, trains, planes and boats) have all been upgraded to incooperate new technologies that increase their distance per fuel rating. Most notably, the electric car has reduced gasoline consumption nearly to zero. Other technologies, such as those in medical fields, have elongated and bettered our lives so we have more time in this life to think about and change the way that we effect our environment. But with these advances, and with every technological advance in history, with every gain that technology brings in making our way of life sustainable, it brings new costs as well. With the advent of medical technologies that have prolonged the human life, comes more years that each of us uses precious resources, taking them from future generations. For example, by increasing the life expectancy of humans by 5 years, we also need to boost the amount of cattle stock to accommodate the extra 5 years that the average person would be consuming beef products. this means that more forests must be cut down to make room for cattle farms. Hybrid technologies, electric vehicals, and other technologies that have reduced the use of gasoline we burn have also made us forget that burning any fuels at all is detrimental to the environment. Even just the little amount of emissions released by a Toyota Prius can have effects on our environment. We forget that, even though we use less fuel, we are still contributing to the problem of emissions. We can not avoid this dual nature of technology. Many eastern religions, including Hinduism, Buhddism and Taoism all have concepts for this phenomenon, namely the idea of Karma. What many westerners do not realize that in every action, not limited to personal interaction, but also including technological advancement, brings benefit and cost, but the bright side of this fact is that things continually become better. With every advancement in technology, the benefits are a small portion greater than the costs. This will continue exponentially in the years to come, however we must always remember that technological karma exists.

Without remembering that every leap in technology will bring costs, we will not ever obtain sustainable living on this earth.Stewarjm192 (talk) 21:32, 14 July 2012 (EDT)

• We have used technology in many ways and forms to help reduce our impact on the environment and improve our quality of life, but we have also increased our impact as well. Many cars nowadays use alternate sources of fuel to run, such as electricity and solar power, and hybrid cars are able to help reduce the amount of gas emissions that we put out. We are still putting out a lot of gas emissions, and more and more coal-burning plants have been built in order to provide the electricity needed to run the electric vehicles. Advancements in medicine have helped increase our life expectancy and made people live smarter and healthier lives. However, this has led to a huge explosion in the human population of Earth, and the more people we have, the more people we have harming the environment. This also leads to more deforestation and overfarming in order to make room for and feed so many people. Many people now have solar-powered homes instead of using electricity, which is not energy efficient. All the leaps in technology humanity has made has had both positive and a negative effect, and no matter what new technologies we come up with, there will always be some sort of negative impact on the environment. AndrewSears (talk) 22:14, 15 July 2012 (EDT)

One of my favorite (rather mischievous) examples is to point out: "Modern medicine has saved many lives, and those saved people are consuming resources and contributing to climate change. If we got rid of modern medicine, we could therefore reduce our environmental impact." Clearly I'm not suggesting we go back to a life expectancy of 50 or so, but it does provide a nice example of how there are negative costs associated with an obvious good such as longer life expectancy. Martin A. Walker 07:58, 15 July 2012 (EDT)